George Papadopoulos discusses the deep state 2024

Joe Hoft: It’s my distinct pleasure and honor to introduce our next guest a young man whose life got flipped upside down a few years back for just really trying to make a living in a in a start to his career and all of a sudden, he found himself right in the middle of a hornet’s nest. And, and so I can’t wait to talk to him more but the great George Papadopoulos is with us today. Welcome, George.

George Papadopoulos: Thanks a lot for having me, Joe. It’s a real pleasure.

Joe Hoft: It’s great having you. Like I mentioned, briefly during the break here, I’ve met your wife. I’ve talked to her on this show and I believe on another radio show I had and also, have, have had some communications with her. She’s been challenged through this whole episode in your career as well, just docking all the all that happened. I’m really anxious. I know I know some. I know quite a bit, but I’m really anxious to hear the story from you. I know that you were a young man, I believe, from Chicago, if that’s correct.

And you found yourself overseas and all of a sudden, people like Joseph Misfud and others came into your life. And after that experience, your life was flipped upside down. So Why don’t you tell us a bit about, you know, your start, how you got over to Europe, what happened then leading up to meeting George, or Joseph Misfud.

George Papadopoulos: So, I was relatively young if you consider that, you know, people running for the presidency right now. They’re in their late seventies. Biden obviously is 80 or close to 80. And, back when I was in my late twenties, I had just finished working at a think tank called the Hudson Institute, which is, back then, I guess I appreciated a different ideology, which was more of like, a neo conservative, you know, war, you know, being the war drums ideology.

And a lot of my colleagues were people who held high ranking positions during the Reagan administration, the George H W Bush Administration, the George W Bush Administration. You had people like Douglas Fife, Scooter Libby, Seth Cropsey.

These were some of my colleagues. Obviously, they were part of the failed Iraq war, and Afghanistan strategies. And, you know, the rest is history. So, going into the summer of 2015, after I started to lose faith in that type of ideology, that type of strategy, that type of future for the American people, or for the United States as a whole, I looked around and I saw candidates in the summer of 2015 that I thought really espoused a new direction for the American people for American freedom, prosperity, and security. And two candidates really stood out to me.

The first was Ben Carson, who is an incredible guy. I really thought he epitomized the American dream, and I worked for him first. Actually, I was an advisor to Ben Carson and his presidential campaign first. And after he dropped out, I joined Donald Trump’s campaign in March of 2016, and then the rest really is history in terms of the entire global intelligence community falling into my lap, the spying situation that went on, and it really was designed to utilize specific elements of a campaign to overthrow an administration. And that’s really what I was caught in the crosshairs of.

Joe Hoft: It was unbelievable. You mentioned Ben Carson too. He was a great guy. Trump ended up bringing him into his administration.

I think he did a great job and he’s a good man, a good Christian man. He’s a brilliant guy. So, I could see why you’re attracted to him. I was too. I fell on the Trump train as well as Jim.

I think the thing that grabbed me about Trump was he was hitting the media. And he was saying, you guys lie and nobody’s ever said that before, and it was so refreshing because I’ve from a distance through 2016 been a corporate executive over in Hong Kong, and I’m watching things in the US and getting a bird’s eye view through Jim at the Gateway Pundit. And, it’s seen this media that had a whole separate narrative than reality, especially under Obama. And so, that was really refreshing for me and Jim. And then, we jumped on the Trump train right away.

And, we didn’t hear your name, probably didn’t read your name until there was this pressure that was put on Trump in early 2016. They said, “hey. you don’t know anything about foreign policy. Who’s your list of people that are going to help you to better understand the world?”

And I believe your name was on that list. Wasn’t it? And Carter Page’s. How was it? First of all, correct me if I’m wrong, but secondly, why don’t you get your name on that list?

George Papadopoulos: So, like I mentioned, I think it was the the background I had in energy Hudson Institute, and then obviously working for another presidential campaign, because obviously there’s been so much misinformation disinformation thrown out there.

People felt that George Papadopoulos kind of fell from the sky into a presidential campaign in the heat of the moment and that’s what actually happened.

There’s nothing further than the truth. Like I said, I spent my entire career after grad school working in a very prominent think tank with some of the people I just mentioned, then work for Ben Carson’s presidential campaign And after Ben Carson was obviously the only candidate who actually even led in the polls. See, people forget that. They thought Trump was leading from a to z throughout the 2016 campaign.

Carson was the only candidate that actually had a short term, you know, blip where he was in front of Trump. Then of course, you had the terrorist attacks in Brussels, if you remember.

And people have decided we need a stronger leader. We need somebody who’s going to take charge. Really, you know, provide security or at least take a tough approach to really the same kind of issues we’re dealing with today as Islamist extremism.

Islamicists violence that we’re seeing now between Israel and Hamas and how it’s really reverberating throughout the United States. So That’s how I joined Trump’s campaign.

And, yes, I was part of that group. It was with Michael Flynn-Carter Page. I think a couple others and then that group obviously evolved and metastasized into a much bigger, advisory panel.

Joe Hoft: Yeah. But the thing that as I look back and this is something I discovered or uncovered shortly after your story or at some point, maybe even a year after, was that I somehow stumbled upon some information that it was Jeff Sessions that put this team together. Is that correct? Was this team, these team Sessions?

George Papadopoulos: He was a senator at the time. So, he was certainly at the head of the advisory group because I remember during our meeting with Trump and the advisory group, Trump was on one end of the table, whereas Jeff Sessions was on the other end of the table. And the candidate at that time would defer to Jeff Sessions in terms of the input from the various members.

I remember when I brought up this infamous idea of setting up a meeting between Trump and Putin during the campaign, he deferred to Jeff Sessions, “Jeff, what do you think?” You know, and some of the others and all this kind of stuff.

So, little did I know here’s a really important part of this entire story. Little did I know that my background that I briefly discussed here actually put a target on me that followed me into my work with Trump’s campaign.

See, when I met all of these infamous spies, all of these meetings, you don’t simply walk into meetings with the equivalent of the Secretary of State of the United States or the minister or the secretary of defense within working for a presidential campaign in two weeks.

So, I think that there was a target already on Trump.

The moment he decided to announce the deep state and the global intelligence apparatus was monitoring any viable threat to Hillary Clinton and they targeted conservative presidential campaigns. I’m certainly sure Trump’s campaign wasn’t the only one targeted.

I know Ted Cruz. I remember he was discussing that his campaign might have been targeted. Probably Ben Carson’s, when he was leading in the polls. So, basically, what I’m saying here is it wasn’t simply a random act of God that the spying happened or it spontaneously happened. You had general Flynn targeted in London the way I was targeted, except he was targeted by the same people going back in 2015, So this entire thing was a setup.

It was a predetermined preplanned setup. And in my book, Deep State Target, I really detail the intricate ways that they went about this thing, which we would probably take hours to have to get to the core of.

Joe Hoft: I’ve got to get your book, George. I never have, and I apologize for that, but I know I’d love it because I was so involved with what happened in my career as an executive over in Hong Kong.

I started writing for Jim at the Gateway Pundit in 2016 after we both fell in love with Trump. From that period on, I wrote at least one post a day for about five years. And then it when I came to the US and started writing full time at the Gateway Pundit alongside Jim, I started writing about the Mueller investigation. And there were some guys that joined me that had some that were pretty smart people.

And you had to be careful because some of these people, I think, were inserted to send me garbage information. There were some others that were really spot on and we started to destroy the Mueller investigation.

My question, I’m going to throw this on the table, George. I don’t want to make you uncomfortable. You don’t have to answer. But do you believe after this whole thing with Sessions, I was so disgusted with Jeff Sessions that he allowed this Mueller investigation to continue with this rabid group of people in secret because there’s conflict of interest.

You can’t do an audit if there’s even the appearance of a conflict yet this whole team was rapidly conflicted against Trump, and sessions allowed that to happen.

And I look back and here’s my question for you. And I think maybe you cannot know what I’m going to ask. Was Jeff Sessions involved in this? Because he brought you in. He brought in Carter, Jones, and Flynn.

Three people that were targeted. So, was he behind this? He also was the only senator that I’m aware of, as I recall, that really jumped on the Trump team. And so, my question now with hindsight, looking back, was he involved? Was he working to set up president Trump rather than to be his ally?

What do you think?

George Papadopoulos: Well, let me qualify your question for a second. So, what really happened here? And if there’s one thing I want you and your viewers to get out of this interview we’re having is to replace the word Russia with CIA, Mi6, and FBI. That’s really what went on during the 2016 campaign, these groups, meaning the intelligence community of the west, including Countries in Italy, and the 5 Eyes intelligence group, New Zealand, Canada, Australia, England, and the United States. They really concocted this plan to take down president Trump. They were all heavily invested in this operation, and I believe they all had vested interests in Hillary Clinton winning.

So, the reason I mentioned this is when you have these types of organizations involved and you have the type of manpower and money and surveillance that went into basically overthrowing a president, a sitting senator is a sitting duck in the crosshairs of this group just like I was, just like, you know, Flynn was.

And I don’t know what happened with Sessions. But if I would surmise what I think really happened, I think they threatened him. I think they threatened Sessions with potentially prosecuting him, probably for some garbage like perjury or, you know, when they were going after everybody, interviewing them, you know, doing God knows what to them.

And they probably said, listen, if you don’t cooperate or if you don’t allow us to go after the main fish, which is the president, we’re going to go after you, and we’re going to go after your family. They did it to me. They did it to Michael Flynn, where they were going after his son.

So, you saw this disturbing pattern emerge where the collateral damage, meaning the associates or even the senator who’s an attorney general was all basically meat for the grinder to get Trump. So, I think that’s what happened.

I think that’s exactly why he was defamed and why he allowed these, you know, partisan hacks to do what they did. And unfortunately, for Trump, there’s another disturbing trend he decided to really trust while he was president.

I’m not talking about the campaign, but while he was president, people who were backstabbers, who weren’t loyal, and were actually working to undermine him, including attorney general Barr later on.

Joe Hoft: And, for that matter, my opinion now is, see, I’m just so sinister. Just think this stuff’s been so rapidly, just illegal, unconstitutional, and just really a coup d’état. And these guys are going to do anything seeing what’s going on now. I just mentioned the border and everything else. I’m just wondering if Sessions weren’t involved.

Both I, and Mike Pence as well. I wrote three books on election steal, and one of them’s January 6th and Pence had the duty to step in and say these things. These elections are not certifiable, and he passed on that. And I just thought that’s when I thought maybe he was in on this all for four years as well. So, I couldn’t agree with you more. I couldn’t agree with you more.

So, you ended up, with my understanding, you were actually working for Israel with the energy sector. There was some oil that they had had found or located in the Mediterranean. And they were hoping to build a pipeline to Europe. And you were helping them, correct me if I’m wrong, to try to get a pipeline built to Europe. And my understanding was that it was killed, that Obama somehow pushed through. It was either Ukraine, Russia or Israel, and Israel was not going to get anything to happen.

So, is that how you were brought into this?

George Papadopoulos: So, actually, I’m very happy you did bring this up because let’s look at facts. When I was interviewed by Mueller’s team after, you know, about 30 hours of them interviewing me or whatever they were trying to do, they basically were telling me that we’re going to try and frame me as some sort of Israeli agent. And I said, what are you talking about? I’ve never taken a penny from the Israeli government. I’ve never done anything illegal with any foreign governments.

I worked in foreign policy for all my career, I worked in the thing. I worked as a foreign policy adviser to presidential campaigns. Obviously, I have foreign contacts. You know, and I brokered the meeting that Trump had with the Egyptian president.

So, yeah, of course, I know people and once they told me that, I said, okay. Now I know what this really is all about. Remember how I mentioned that there was a target following me into these campaigns? And this was not spontaneous. And they were monitoring people who were viewed as potential enemies of the regime’s foreign policy or their ideology, meaning Obama. This is what happened.

So, you’re absolutely right. I was never representing the Israeli government. Actually, my clients were American oil companies, namely, Noble Energy, that was operating back between 2011-2016 in Israel and Cyprus to develop offshore oil and gas for the first time in that country’s history.

So, I was working with an American interest-American company. And the Obama administration, just to not to complicate the geopolitical thing, what the Obama administration wanted to do was basically allow the Muslim Brotherhood.

Remember the Arab Spring? It happened in 2010. They wanted Turkey and the Arab spring to be basically the new norm in the Middle East that basically would suffocate Israel and that the entire Middle East would become like you know, the days of prophet Mohammed back in 600 AD. We have a different vision for the region, and we thought that Israel should actually not have to be suffocated by these types of antiquated governing systems, but actually support more secular forces in the Middle East. That’s why you know, general Sisi when he came to power, we thought that was a good move.

We thought that it would be beneficial to the United States if Israel would export its energy to Europe by working with NATO partners like Greece, EU members like Cyprus, and not depend on Turkey. And what really was at the core of the disagreement was, do we allow Israel to work with Turkey or Israel to work with the west?

And Obama wanted Turkey to be the power in the region, and we did not want that to happen. So, when I was on the campaign, there was an infamous spy episode, and this is important why I mentioned the background about Israel and Turkey, when a guy called Stefan Halper tried to set me up in in in the UK. You’ve probably heard of this name because he was all over the media. He set up Flynn with that Russian woman Svetlana Lakova.

He set me up with a Turkish national who was a masquerading honey pot and a research assistant to him regarding this exact pipeline that we’re talking about right now. It didn’t work.

And, you know, I cover this in the book, so I don’t want to get into too many complicated details about that. But, this is some of the evidence of why this followed me. And the last thing I’ll say about this, if you look at the situation today in Israel, and Gaza, it’s all about the oil. And I believe that Turkey itself is going to get involved based on this situation and it’s why they’re openly supporting Hamas.

Joe Hoft: I hadn’t even thought of that. That comes from left field for me, but that’s amazing. I, you know, I put you spot on.

This honey pot, do you know her name? Do you know her real name?

George Papadopoulos: So, I testified behind closed doors, to the House Oversight Committee in, I think, 2019, 2018. I can’t remember. It’s either 2018 or 2019.

And it was with Mark Meadows, who was the chairman at the time. He later became the chief of staff of the White House and I testified to John Ratcliffe as well, who became the head of DNI, the head of the director of National Intelligence.

So, the two congressmen that I testified about, what we’re talking about here, they had all this information and I told them the name of this person. Her name was Ozritur. This was a fake name, of course. And there was a story that came out in the New York Times, which is very disturbing about this person and Stefan Halper, where the New York Times, not me, said this wasn’t an FBI official.

Remember how people thought this was simply an FBI operation with a couple fringe, you know, people like Peter Strzok and Lisa Page running amok?

It wasn’t. It was about the global intelligence community targeting the campaign, and the New York Times said that basically she’s CIA in foreign intelligence. And I told Meadows, I told John Radcliffe this.

I told him about Joseph Misfud, some of these other people that were all involved. And, unfortunately, they didn’t do anything with this information back at the heat of the moment when they should have used it to go on offense and to support the president.

So, I think the only conclusion I draw from this is because, as I explained at the beginning of this conversation, you replace the word Russia with CIA and MI6. And that’s really what happened in 2016. And if they reveal to the world that the Western Intelligence community was openly interfering in the presidential election, that would have deleterious consequences for NATO, for the US intelligence sharing, you know, relationships with these foreign governments, and it probably would be the end of, many of these security partnerships that the United States had.

So, they had to cover it up. I think not because they wanted to, but because it was out of necessity, and that’s really why you saw Durham during the Durham testimony, trying to cover everything up. I think you had Matt Goetz, don’t know if you saw the Durham testimony, but I highly recommend you and your viewers just to Google Matt Goetz-John Durham testimony exchange.

He pressed them. Why are you not exposing what Papadopoulos told us what these spies were doing to Papadopoulos, and to Trump, and to Flynn, and others?

And Durham basically sat back and was fuming like I want to tell you, but I can’t. My hands are tied, and that really goes into what I think attorney general Barr did by handcuffing him and actually was a traitor against Trump the way that we saw Sessions defamed.

So, it’s an incredible story, and I really think that the main reason people should want Trump back in office is not simply because he was the best president in modern history for the economy. He secured the border and it was good on traditional values.

If you believe in that kind of stuff like I do, he was great. But what’s even more important than that is that he wants a clean house. He wants to end the weaponization of government, which I believe now has become the most important issue of the 2024 election because the economy is cyclical and foreign policy can change in a heartbeat.

But if you have no rule of law at home and no trust in government, or if you believe that the FBI is basically a tool of a party to go after their political opponents, we don’t have a sustainable country, though. And that’s really why I think Trump is the right guy now to take care of that problem.

Joe Hoft: Yeah. I agree with that. And by the way, I was just here, you know, looking at you. Yeah. You’re in your late twenties when this all came down.

And has the thought ever crossed your mind that natural laws are in place that you might be one of the last people standing from this whole episode in US history. Really historical event and, it’s just shameful, really, ultimately, you know, what happened to you.

I’m just so disgusted at all this writing about this. I was, ever, you know, if you mentioned this about Russia. I wrote a piece at the Gateway Pundit where I said that it looks like the culprit here is not Russia.

It’s the UK. At that point, we knew of Halper. We knew of others, that you could probably mention that it’s like these people are involved. They’re from the UK. Well, well, the dossier guy first steals from MI6.

It was like, no. It doesn’t look like it’s Russia. You know, it looks like this is more connected to the UK, than anything. As a matter of fact, a good friend, Tony Schafer, I’m not sure if you met Tony.

Tony, came out and said, yeah, it looks like the UK was spying on Trump Tower. So, they were so the CIA could use the UK MI6 to spy in the US and then use that information against Trump. And, Tony said that, yes, it’s very plausible. That’s what’s happening. And Tony got let go by Fox like the next day.

They never had him back on. So, you know, the media was certainly involved in this as well. What’s your impression speaking about that of the New York Times and the media they were pushing this narrative, for the deep state.

George Papadopoulos: Unfortunately, because I’ve dealt with a lot of these media. They’re actually my wife, Simona, and we even have a cover story of our life in the Washington Post magazine about a lot of the stuff that we’re discussing here. So, it’s a fascinating article, actually. I think it was a fair article. And, in that article, I basically told the Washington Post, that this was an operation with British and Australian help.

And I think that the Israelis probably were involved to some extent based on some of the weird interchanges that I had with them leading to the meeting with the Australian and all this stuff with the UK and, part of, you know, the 5 eyes intelligence agreement that we discussed earlier. And, unfortunately, like I said, I think that the media has been treated. And I don’t think that Mockingbird is a theory. I think it’s real. And I think that they are mouthpieces of the uni-party or of the military industrial complex.

I’ll give a couple examples. Besides my testimony to Congress, like I mentioned, and this interview to the Washington Post that was fortunately published, right when my name went public, I think, in October of 2017, that’s when I told the New York Times I was framed, This Australian Diplomat was an operative.

He was recording my conversation, which I testified to and the FBI basically told me he was a spy. All of this stuff that we’re talking about here, I try telling the New York Times and the Washington Post, they never published a thing. I told them about Halper, they never published a thing.

This is before Halper, maybe the one public. This is before any of this went public, before spy gate narrative, any of this stuff went public. They intentionally withheld this information because they were colluding, I believe, with the intelligence community and the deep state to take down Trump.

So, the media today is not doing what you’re doing. It’s not actually trying to uncover scandals the way they did going back to the Vietnam war Whatever the media has evolved to today, they decide what they are allowed to reveal to the American public and not only are they mouthpieces, I think, of these various interests, but they actually are designed to suppress information that goes against these interests that we’ve been discussing here today.

And I think that’s even more disturbing, and it goes really into the core as I mentioned, of what America has now become, and it’s unrecognizable.

Joe Hoft: Yeah, absolutely. I couldn’t agree more. Yeah, they live these little slivers and then say, okay. Well, we’re done with that story. We’ve already mentioned this.

No. There’s another 99% that you’re leaving out. That needs to be told. And, that’s the shame with this media. 

George Papadopoulos: So, as I mentioned, I think that there was a target following myself and others way before we ever joined Trump’s campaign. So that’s just very important, I think, because the fake narrative was that this thing spontaneously erupted and, you know, then the FBI ran into it, you know, work and they were doing their patriotic duty, their combatting Russian disinformation, all this nonsense.

So that’s the fake old narrative. When you look at the real story of how this entire thing was put into motion, it really all starts in Rome, like you mentioned. And, that’s where I met Joseph Misfud, and Joseph Misfud is a mysterious Maltese national, professor who was introduced to me at a university called Link Campus.

Now Link Campus is a school. It’s not the US school that trains the FSB or the SVU or Russian intelligence or Iranian intelligence or any of this. Later, I found out Western intelligence people. It held symposiums with David Ignatius of the Washington Post about the CIA.

I mean, we’re talking about a very high-level type of place. And when I went to this campus, there was the Italian foreign minister, Vincenzo Scotti, came to me, we’re talking to foreign minister, the equivalent of the US Secretary of State.

Okay? Before my name was public in the Washington Post article that you mentioned. Okay? So, let me just make it clear. Before my name was public in that article with Flynn about me with Trump’s campaign, the Italian foreign minister knew who I was, and was already arranging a meeting for me at a spy campus with Joseph Misfud who later created the pretext of the Russia collusion hoax.

Okay? I met with him there, and he was introduced to me as somebody who knows people, knows the world, could be helpful down the line and, you know, politics and presidential campaign stuff. Now the reason I was caught off guard and I wasn’t suspicious of this entire thing is because the meeting was in Rome. The meeting was brokered by the Italian foreign minister; the meeting wasn’t in Moscow. The meeting wasn’t brokered in Tehran.

Did you understand? So the moment that this entire thing was set in motion before my name was public in the Washington Post, then the Australian government decided to meet with me three times in 3 weeks leading up to this infamous bar meeting with the Australian Ambassador where they were trying to basically get me to repeat what this guy, Misfud, told me, and that was, hey, George, you know, that the Russians have Hillary’s emails. Now it goes back to what you mentioned about this information already being public at the time. If you look at Andrew, Judge Napolitano, he used to be on Fox News. He was openly on Fox News saying, hey, that the Russians probably have Hillary’s emails.

It’s a scandal. This was open information. So, when Mifsud had repeated this information to me, I think it was in April 2016, that was what was designed as a hook to get me to then repeat this to a foreign government that would then create a fake pretext to start a fake investigation.

Now the reason that the investigation didn’t go anywhere and why Durham said that this should have never opened into a real investigation is because I testified that the Australian diplomat actually was a spy. I testified if you look at my transcript, to Congress.

I lay out unequivocally what happened at that meeting. There’s an entire chapter in my book about it. And I even reported him to the FBI into Mueller, where I said that this guy was recording my conversation in the bar.

He was asking me bizarre questions, trying to goad me into something that I had no knowledge about, just like g gossip, and I reported him. And the reason that the investigation went nowhere is because I had no information.

They tried to frame this information into my lap and it, you know, it just failed. So basically, to summarize, this entire thing started in Rome, this entire thing was designed with the help of the Australian governments to launch this investigation, and it failed because I knew nothing. And, this guy Mifsud has disappeared now.

Joe Hoft: Well, yeah, and he’s still disappeared, isn’t he? The thing too, Italy, Italy’s government, and they were involved as well. Would you say that?

George Papadopoulos: Well, well, if you look at it, certainly.

Joe Hoft: It’s several individuals. Yeah.

George Papadopoulos: So, when the Italian foreign minister is brokering meetings, that results in probably one of the biggest scandals in modern American history. Obviously, Italy’s involved, right? When Joseph Mifsud, who was connected to the Italian government, is involved at the center of this scandal, then Italy is involved, unfortunately, now why did Italy get involved? It goes back to what I said, about vested interests. These governments at the time were socialist.

The Italian government was run by Renzi, who was a socialist, he was an ally of Barack Obama. You had the UK that didn’t want Brexit, and Trump was very openly Brexit. You had all of these globalist agendas that were converging at what they thought would have been the perfect moments with Hillary Clinton as Obama’s third term.

And I think that’s why these governments decided to set up Trump, set up his guys, and they were willing to take the risk to later be exposed because they couldn’t afford Trump to be president.

So That’s how, unfortunately, the situation that, happened, it was covered up to an extent, but, should Trump get reelected, I think the first thing he should do is not only declassify all of the stuff that we’re talking about, but actually reveal it to the American public as well.

Joe Hoft: Well, actually, there’s some information as well that the documents that they took at Mar a Lago were related to this Cross-Fire Hurricane that they went in there. They stole these documents and then, labeled said, made up this lie that president trump didn’t have the right to have these documents. And now they’re charging him with that. It’s just so over the top, such incredible abuse. You just can’t even believe it takes your breath away really every day anymore.

And, so I agree with that.

George Papadopoulos: No. And based on what you just said, if it really was all about collusion, and he was holding these documents about Russia, that’s already been propagated, right? We’ve had hearings. We’ve had three different hearings. We’ve had Comey, Horowitz, Durham, and Mueller, I should say four hearings about this.

So that was all out in the public that fake information. If what Trump was holding him, Mar a Lago had to do with Russians and all this garbage, this fake stuff, they wouldn’t care, right? But what they care about is what we’re talking about here.

I think Trump had documents revealing what we’re talking about here about the potential wiretapping of Trump Tower, the way that Shafer was discussing why they fired him at Fox, like you mentioned, about some of this stuff we’re talking about here, why the FISA warrants are still blacked out, even after Trump declassified them, what really went into this stuff? Why, you know, how many governments were involved here?

Why were they calling us agents of foreign governments with no information, you know, and I think that’s why they raided him to get all that stuff back so that he couldn’t properly reveal it to the American public. And I think that’s really what the biggest fear they have of him actually getting back into power said about his economic policies or the 10 percent tariffs that he wants to put on China, that’s not what they’re afraid of. I really believe that they’re afraid of him, because they don’t want him revealing what we’re talking about here in a declassified setting to the American public because it would totally upend both security partnerships with the US with the West and intelligence sharing agreements that the United States has with NATO and with these 5 eyes groups like Australia and the UK. So that’s, I mean, it’s, it’s really remarkable.

I mean, I’m, I’m at a loss for words that I’ve been about this for years, you know, just thinking of the gravity of what we’re dealing with, we’re a sitting an ex-president has been indicted over superfluous charges, baseless charges in order to prevent him from getting into office, not to really clean house, and that’s what this is about.

Joe Hoft: Yeah. Thanks, George. We’re going to have to end it on that. That’s perfect. Hope to have you back.

I could tell some more fascinating stories. God bless you. So sorry. You had to go through all this, but, thank god it was you because you’re a strong young man. I appreciate all you’ve done for this country and for your family and yourself.

God bless you. Hope to have you back again soon. Thank you. Plan. So thank you.